Interview: “There are only two viable alternatives: Tarcisio or Mouse,” says Ciro Nogueira
Senator Ciro Nogueira (PP) states, in an interview with O Globo, that definition of who will represent the right in 2026 to run for presidency by the opposition should be announced in January and that Tarcísio de Freitas, governor of São Paulo, could not refuse to give reelection if summoned by the political godfather to try the plateau.
Is Bolsonaro taking a long time to decide who will be the right candidate?
Ciro Nogueira: I believe he has already decided. I argue that it communicates this in December to be announced in January. Who will be, only he knows. I wonder, but who has legitimacy and authority to say is he or Flavio (one of his children) or even Michelle (former first lady), who has direct contact with him.
Is it Tarcisio?
CN: If it was today, I see two viable candidates: Tarcisio and Ratinho Júnior. They have half the rejection of Bolsonaro and almost 40% of ignorance, which is growth potential. But they are only feasible with the support of President Bolsonaro.
Also read: Bolsonaro would have endorsed Tarcisio’s candidacy with Michelle de Vice, says Jornal
The Lord said that “border the impossible” Tarcisio is not a candidate if there is support and environment on the right. But he resists advertising.
CN: Don’t border the impossible. It is impossible for him not to be a candidate if he has the support of President Bolsonaro. I followed when Bolsonaro chose him to play in Sao Paulo. He wanted to be a candidate for the Senate in Goiás, had support from Ronaldo Caiado, but Bolsonaro said, “You go to Sao Paulo, go to be governor and win the election.” He obeyed and won. I have no doubt that if you have the Bolsonaro call to the presidency, it won’t turn your back.
Have you spoken to Tarcisio? Is it bothered by this division on the current right?
CN: No, it’s not bothered. He has been working to unify. I have spoken systematically to him.
And how does Tarcisio see Eduardo Bolsonaro’s performance, for example, who said he was a presidential candidate?
CN: I think he has respect for Eduardo and everyone. I told Eduardo myself: It’s time for us to focus on defending her father and facing the true opponent, who is Lula.
Do you continue to act to be Vice of Tarcisio? Some prefer Senator Tereza Cristina.
CN: I never acted to be vice. This will be defined later, according to the candidate’s profile and the parties. The deputy cannot harm the plate and, if you can help, even better. Tereza Cristina would be wonderful. For me, (it would be a name) even (to) president. Michele is also a very good name, is even ahead in some research. But today Bolsonaro told me that she is a Senate candidate, and with a chance of wide victory.
Do you say that it is missing “common sense” to the right to avoid a defeat in 2026. By saying a candidate, Eduardo Bolsonaro hinders?
CN: No. I think it’s legitimate that it puts its name, like any Brazilian. A person as representative as him, since his father is ineligible, has all legitimacy. Now, until it makes it possible to have a very long way. We need a candidate who unifies the right and the center, someone who can campaign here in the country, prepare a government plan, travel through Brazil. Unfortunately, Eduardo does not comply with these prerequisites because he is in the United States.
Read also: Lula promotes “tax accelerator with monetary brake” and disadvantages the bag, says green
In the same message, the Lord speaks of the right, center-right union and his “extreme.” Who of your political group does you consider the far right? Jair Bolsonaro?
CN: It’s the pocketist. I think it is very represented by Eduardo himself. Former President Bolsonaro is more right. I think, especially in the final two years in the Planalto Palace, he had center attitudes. He invited a more center-right person to be his main minister.
In recent days, Eduardo and Carlos Bolsonaro have again moved the idea of “union of the right”. Do you feel hit? Does this get in the way?
CN: I talked to Eduardo two days ago. He is a great friend of mine. I don’t feel hit. He has his point of view, I often say that I went against his struggle to sanction the country, but I also say: I don’t know what I would do if my father was being as wronged as he feels about his. So I can’t judge.
There was an ultimatum for André Fufuca to leave the Ministry of Sport. What is the deadline and what is the party sanction if it does not leave?
CN: It is not ultimatum, but we have the determination that any member of the party or federation that has mandate should leave the positions. We have given a reasonable deadline, and until next week this should be set.
Celso Sabino (Minister of Tourism), who is part of the same federation, has already received an ultimatum, but is stretching the permanence in the government. Is his situation different?
CN: No. His and Fufuca situation are the same. No one wants to leave, but they will have to choose whether they are with the federation or the government. I’m sure both will be faithful to the Federation.
If President Lula calls you to talk about permanence in government, are you going?
CN: No. I have a huge affection for Lula, especially for what he did in the first two terms, but it has no meaning. No conversation with him will happen before leaving the government. We have already made the decision not to be with the president in 2026.
Read also: dispute between Renan and Lira for the exemption of IR exposes political feud in Alagoas
Not even to talk about football, how did you play?
CN: (laughs) He won’t call me to talk about Corinthians and Sao Paulo. You will want support. And that will not happen.
Is someone from the Plateau or any ally of yours trying to make this bridge?
CN: Several. More than a dozen.
Research indicates that Lula has been resuming popularity while the right has suffered a thud with Bolsonaro’s condemnation. Do you think Lula got more right?
CN: No. We were making a lot wrong. Three months ago he was an unfeasible candidate, but because of the narrative about the tariff, mistakenly placed, he benefited. Lula is a candidate with no perspective, a president who looks back. The newest government program is Lula himself. New Bolsa Familia, New My House My Life… All Old. He returned with Chavez’s profile, not Mandela. His return was a mistake, as was Getulio’s return.
The left -wing and shielding expressions of amnesty and PEC have gathered the most people since 2022. Hugo Motta made a mistake and ended up giving strength to the government?
CN: It was a mistake of all of us. Motta did not invent this, the leaders wanted. I defended from the beginning it was only for opinion crimes, with open vote. The population reacted and it was good. The Lula government has no ability to mobilize, hitchhikes in the movements.
Does it argue that the priority of Congress is to vote a broad amnesty that contemplates Bolsonaro or a text restricted to dosimetry?
CN: I defend the broad amnesty. But at the very least we need dosimetry. These feathers are absurd. You can’t give someone who wrote with lipstick on a statue has a greater conviction than those who killed. There is consensus that they were too high. We have to correct.
Do you think the vote on dosimetry has to happen soon?
CN: We have to decide soon. Put this to vote and solve, in one way or another, in the coming days.
The House unanimously approved the bill that expands the income tax exemption. How do you evaluate this text?
CN: I argue that we enjoy (Senate) the way it came from the House as soon as possible. It was a historical vote that showed union of government and opposition. It was promise to both Bolsonaro and Lula. And Hugo Motta, along with rapporteur Arthur Lira, did a consensus construction work.
The Lord is criticized for not facing more radical guidelines. Silas Malafaia, for example, has already called him a “fox” for not supporting an impeachment of Alexandre de Moraes. How do you respond?
CN: It’s true. I said it wasn’t going to happen. They are guidelines just to create a stage, but without any viability. And I prefer to work with what is viable.
